Wrack MOSKVA, Schwarzmeerflotte, 1941
Hallo,
ich suche überprüfbare historische Berichte zum Untergang des russischen Zerstörers MOSKVA, am 26.06.1941, während der Seeschlacht um die Hafenstadt Constanza.
Ursache meiner Nachforschung ist die angebliche Verdrehung der historischen Tatsachen seitens pro-russischer Geschichtsschreibung. Quelle1: "Koslinski N., Stanescu R. Marina Romana in al Doilea Razboi Mondial vol. I". Da wird behauptet dass Moskva auf eine Mine lief.
Andere Quellen behaupten dass ein russisches U-Boot, vermutlich ShCh206, einen Torpedotreffer auf Moskva landete. ( http://www.soviet-empire.com/ussr/viewtopic.php?f=112&p=762493 )
Kann mir jemand die "friendly fire" Hypothese bestätigen?
Daniel Hintergraber behauptet hier auf taucher.net ( http://taucher.net/edb/Mokow__Russischer_Zerstoerer__o10811.html ) dass ein anderes russisches U-Boot, ShCh213, den fatalen Torpedo abschoss.
Für die miserable Qualität dieses und anderer Berichte von Daniel schäme ich mich in Grund und Boden weil ich den Mann kenne und seine Forschung in Muttersprache besser ist.
In der rumänischen Presse: http://www.evz.ro/articole/detalii-articol/886910/Rares-Gheorghe-vanator-de-epave-in-Marea-Neagra/
wird auch auf ein russisches U-Boot hingewiesen, ohne Quelle.
Folgende Verlinkungen auf http://www.scubaboard.ro funktionieren nach kostenloser Registrierung.
Auf rumänischen Internetforen wird heiss debattiert, auf
http://www.scubaboard.ro/forum showthread.php?t=1097
allerdings geht es weniger um Sachliches und mehr um persönliche Auseinandersetzungen. Interessant sind die dort veröffentlicten Karten und Koordinaten.
Von der Seeschlacht um Constanza gibt es eine Karte:
http://www.scubaboard.ro/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=785&d=1268698991
vermutlich aus oben genannter Quelle1.
Auszug aus "Koslinski N., Stanescu R. Marina Romana in al Doilea Razboi Mondial vol. I", ebenfalls übernommen aus scubaboard.ro, Zitat:
On 25 June 1941, at 19:15, a task force made of destroyers HARKOV (P. A. Melnikov) and MOSKVA (A. B. Tyhov) left Sevastopol harbor, followed after two hours and a half by a supporting force made of heavy cruiser VOROSHILOV (F. S. Markov) and destroyers SOOBRAZITELNII (S. S. Volkov) and SMISHLENII (V. P. Veppers). The task force headed to Odessa, then changed direction towards Constanta during night. At 03:42, the Soviet destroyers deployed their anti-mine shield. Minutes later, a mine exploded in the right shield of HARKOV, without causing damage to the ship.
At 03:58, two ships were spotted by destroyer REGINA MARIA, but they were believed to be friendly destroyers at Midia. The two ships heading south-west at high speed opened fire. The first two salvos fell in the waters of Constanta harbor, framing minelayer CAROL (three shells in starboard stern, two shells in port stern). The Soviet destroyers fired 350 shells of 130-mm, at distances up to 24000 meters (over three salvos per minute). It was aimed the Palas railroad station, where an ammunition train has been hit and several fuel tanks were ignited.
At 03:59 AM destroyer MARASTI turned north and armed the 120-mm guns. At 04:12 AM destroyer MARASTI opened fire, starting from 14800 meters, closing to 11400 meters. The first salvo caused the windows of navigation cabin to shatter. Destroyer REGINA MARIA also opened fire.
At 04:15 AM the Soviet destroyers launched smoke screens and headed open sea.
At 04:19 AM destroyer MARASTI ceased fire at a distance of 16000 meters after having fired 19 shells. At 04:22 AM destroyer REGINA MARIA ceased fire at a distance of 18000 meters, after having fired 23 shells.
At 04:22 AM “Tirpitz” coastal battery opened fire, one shot followed after one minute by three salvos of three shots each, firing 53 shells.
The Soviet destroyer MOSKVA suffered a great explosion and broke in two parts, sinking between 04:23 and 04:25. The cause of explosion was the collision with a mine, because the established location of the Soviet destroyer at the moment of the explosion was exactly on the mine barrage in Tuzla area. The mine explosion ignited the ammunition store at the stern.
HARKOV continued the escaping route. A nearby hit damaged the tubes of two steam tanks, causing his speed to drop to 6 knots. Two mechanics (Petr Grebennikov and Petr Kairov), dressed in asbestus suits, emerged for repairs, and at 07:14 the ship recovered its 26 knots.
The supporting task force also approached the Romanian coast. A mine exploded in the shield of SOOBRAZITELNII, causing light damage to the bow of cruiser VOROSHILOV. The cruiser turned away after sending the destroyers SOOBRAZITELNII and SMISHLENII to provide AA support for the retreating HARKOV.
Zitat Ende.
MfG,
Psetta Callatis
google: psetta maxima / psetta maeotica
ich suche überprüfbare historische Berichte zum Untergang des russischen Zerstörers MOSKVA, am 26.06.1941, während der Seeschlacht um die Hafenstadt Constanza.
Ursache meiner Nachforschung ist die angebliche Verdrehung der historischen Tatsachen seitens pro-russischer Geschichtsschreibung. Quelle1: "Koslinski N., Stanescu R. Marina Romana in al Doilea Razboi Mondial vol. I". Da wird behauptet dass Moskva auf eine Mine lief.
Andere Quellen behaupten dass ein russisches U-Boot, vermutlich ShCh206, einen Torpedotreffer auf Moskva landete. ( http://www.soviet-empire.com/ussr/viewtopic.php?f=112&p=762493 )
Kann mir jemand die "friendly fire" Hypothese bestätigen?
Daniel Hintergraber behauptet hier auf taucher.net ( http://taucher.net/edb/Mokow__Russischer_Zerstoerer__o10811.html ) dass ein anderes russisches U-Boot, ShCh213, den fatalen Torpedo abschoss.
Für die miserable Qualität dieses und anderer Berichte von Daniel schäme ich mich in Grund und Boden weil ich den Mann kenne und seine Forschung in Muttersprache besser ist.
In der rumänischen Presse: http://www.evz.ro/articole/detalii-articol/886910/Rares-Gheorghe-vanator-de-epave-in-Marea-Neagra/
wird auch auf ein russisches U-Boot hingewiesen, ohne Quelle.
Folgende Verlinkungen auf http://www.scubaboard.ro funktionieren nach kostenloser Registrierung.
Auf rumänischen Internetforen wird heiss debattiert, auf
http://www.scubaboard.ro/forum showthread.php?t=1097
allerdings geht es weniger um Sachliches und mehr um persönliche Auseinandersetzungen. Interessant sind die dort veröffentlicten Karten und Koordinaten.
Von der Seeschlacht um Constanza gibt es eine Karte:
http://www.scubaboard.ro/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=785&d=1268698991
vermutlich aus oben genannter Quelle1.
Auszug aus "Koslinski N., Stanescu R. Marina Romana in al Doilea Razboi Mondial vol. I", ebenfalls übernommen aus scubaboard.ro, Zitat:
On 25 June 1941, at 19:15, a task force made of destroyers HARKOV (P. A. Melnikov) and MOSKVA (A. B. Tyhov) left Sevastopol harbor, followed after two hours and a half by a supporting force made of heavy cruiser VOROSHILOV (F. S. Markov) and destroyers SOOBRAZITELNII (S. S. Volkov) and SMISHLENII (V. P. Veppers). The task force headed to Odessa, then changed direction towards Constanta during night. At 03:42, the Soviet destroyers deployed their anti-mine shield. Minutes later, a mine exploded in the right shield of HARKOV, without causing damage to the ship.
At 03:58, two ships were spotted by destroyer REGINA MARIA, but they were believed to be friendly destroyers at Midia. The two ships heading south-west at high speed opened fire. The first two salvos fell in the waters of Constanta harbor, framing minelayer CAROL (three shells in starboard stern, two shells in port stern). The Soviet destroyers fired 350 shells of 130-mm, at distances up to 24000 meters (over three salvos per minute). It was aimed the Palas railroad station, where an ammunition train has been hit and several fuel tanks were ignited.
At 03:59 AM destroyer MARASTI turned north and armed the 120-mm guns. At 04:12 AM destroyer MARASTI opened fire, starting from 14800 meters, closing to 11400 meters. The first salvo caused the windows of navigation cabin to shatter. Destroyer REGINA MARIA also opened fire.
At 04:15 AM the Soviet destroyers launched smoke screens and headed open sea.
At 04:19 AM destroyer MARASTI ceased fire at a distance of 16000 meters after having fired 19 shells. At 04:22 AM destroyer REGINA MARIA ceased fire at a distance of 18000 meters, after having fired 23 shells.
At 04:22 AM “Tirpitz” coastal battery opened fire, one shot followed after one minute by three salvos of three shots each, firing 53 shells.
The Soviet destroyer MOSKVA suffered a great explosion and broke in two parts, sinking between 04:23 and 04:25. The cause of explosion was the collision with a mine, because the established location of the Soviet destroyer at the moment of the explosion was exactly on the mine barrage in Tuzla area. The mine explosion ignited the ammunition store at the stern.
HARKOV continued the escaping route. A nearby hit damaged the tubes of two steam tanks, causing his speed to drop to 6 knots. Two mechanics (Petr Grebennikov and Petr Kairov), dressed in asbestus suits, emerged for repairs, and at 07:14 the ship recovered its 26 knots.
The supporting task force also approached the Romanian coast. A mine exploded in the shield of SOOBRAZITELNII, causing light damage to the bow of cruiser VOROSHILOV. The cruiser turned away after sending the destroyers SOOBRAZITELNII and SMISHLENII to provide AA support for the retreating HARKOV.
Zitat Ende.
MfG,
Psetta Callatis
google: psetta maxima / psetta maeotica